Cannot delete folder placed in "My Computer" sub directory

Exactly what error message are you getting when you attempt to delete the
directory.

BTW: read only on a directory is totally irrelevant. In fact the XP GUI
doesn't even display it on the properties sheet contrary to what you think
you see.
--
Walter Clayton
Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.

Post by RickALO
I recently had a hard drive going bad, so I backed up info from my documents
onto another computer. After replacing the hard drive, I "restored" the files
using the XP backup tool. It work, but created a documents folder in the "my
documents" sub directory, not within the "c:" sub directory.
I moved the files to the proper "My Documents" are, but now I cannot delete
the folder listed under "My Computer"... in properties, it shows as read
only, so I unchecked that, but after applying and closing and returning, it
shows as read only again...
I would appreciate any help you might be able to offer....
Rick

R. C. White

2005-03-21 20:08:20 UTC

Hi, Walter.

I agree that "read only on a directory is totally irrelevant", but when I
right-click on a folder and choose Properties, the Read-only property IS
displayed. It generally is greyed out - neither checked nor unchecked - but
it IS shown. And I just now found an unneeded empty folder on my HD and
deleted it with a simple right-click, then Delete, even though Read-only was
grey.

Rick, I'm not sure HOW you are trying to delete that now-empty folder or WHY
WinXP won't do it. My guess is that you told it to Restore to C:\My
Documents, rather than to C:\, resulting in C:\My Documents\My Documents, or
something like that. Sometimes we have to point to the parent of our target
folder, rather than directly to the target itself.

If all else fails to delete the unneeded folder, you can open a "DOS" window
and use the rd (rmdir or Remove Directory) command, possibly including the
/r switch to include any files and subfolders (even Hidden, System and
Read-only ones) that may be within that folder tree.

If that doesn't work, please post back with exactly what you tried and
exactly what results you see.

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
***@corridor.net
Microsoft Windows MVP

Post by Walter Clayton
Exactly what error message are you getting when you attempt to delete the
directory.
BTW: read only on a directory is totally irrelevant. In fact the XP GUI
doesn't even display it on the properties sheet contrary to what you think
you see.
--
Walter Clayton
Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.

Walter Clayton

2005-03-21 22:27:54 UTC

Post by R. C. White
Hi, Walter.
I agree that "read only on a directory is totally irrelevant", but when I
right-click on a folder and choose Properties, the Read-only property IS
displayed. It generally is greyed out - neither checked nor unchecked -
but it IS shown. And I just now found an unneeded empty folder on my HD
and deleted it with a simple right-click, then Delete, even though
Read-only was grey.

:-)

Nope. What the GUI displays in the properties sheet on a directory has
nothing to do with the RO attribute of the directory.

To see for yourself:
Create an empty directory, right click the directory and select properties.
Close the property sheet. Now use "attrib +r directory" to set the RO
attribute. Look at the property sheet again. Does it change?

R. C. White

2005-03-21 22:48:58 UTC

Hi, Walter.

Post by Walter Clayton
Look at the property sheet again. Does it change?

No, it doesn't change. But it's still there! Enough to confuse me - and
just about anybody else, I would think.

Post by Walter Clayton
In fact the XP GUI doesn't even display it on the properties sheet

It DOES display the greyed-out Read-only status, even though it is
meaningless.

Post by Walter Clayton
Nope. What the GUI displays in the properties sheet on a directory has
nothing to do with the RO attribute of the directory.

On this we agree! ;<)

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
***@corridor.net
Microsoft Windows MVP

:-)
Nope. What the GUI displays in the properties sheet on a directory has
nothing to do with the RO attribute of the directory.
Create an empty directory, right click the directory and select
properties. Close the property sheet. Now use "attrib +r directory" to set
the RO attribute. Look at the property sheet again. Does it change?

Walter Clayton

2005-03-22 03:16:28 UTC

Post by R. C. White
Hi, Walter.

Post by Walter Clayton
Look at the property sheet again. Does it change?

No, it doesn't change. But it's still there! Enough to confuse me - and
just about anybody else, I would think.

Post by Walter Clayton
In fact the XP GUI doesn't even display it on the properties sheet

It DOES display the greyed-out Read-only status, even though it is
meaningless.

Actually it has meaning, but it's totaly unrelated to the state of the RO
attribute of directory. ;-)

Statement still stands; the option on the property sheet has nothing to do
with RO attribute of the directory. It literally does not display anything
related to the RO status bit on a or any directory.

What is displayed is an optional status change request for *files* within
the directory heirarchy.

Post by R. C. White

Post by Walter Clayton
Nope. What the GUI displays in the properties sheet on a directory has
nothing to do with the RO attribute of the directory.

On this we agree! ;<)
RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
Microsoft Windows MVP

Post by R. C. White
Hi, Walter.
I agree that "read only on a directory is totally irrelevant", but when
I right-click on a folder and choose Properties, the Read-only property
IS displayed. It generally is greyed out - neither checked nor
unchecked - but it IS shown. And I just now found an unneeded empty
folder on my HD and deleted it with a simple right-click, then Delete,
even though Read-only was grey.

:-)
Nope. What the GUI displays in the properties sheet on a directory has
nothing to do with the RO attribute of the directory.
Create an empty directory, right click the directory and select
properties. Close the property sheet. Now use "attrib +r directory" to
set the RO attribute. Look at the property sheet again. Does it change?

--
Walter Clayton
Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.

Andrew Morton

2005-03-22 08:31:56 UTC

Post by Walter Clayton
What is displayed is an optional status change request for *files*
within the directory heirarchy.

So, what would cause that option to be enabled? If the parent folder happens
to be subject to a reparse point, would that do it? If not, how do you find
what has enabled the status change request?

For example, I used junction from www.sysinternals.com to redirect my
Desktop folder to a different partition and I am seeing the same symptom as
the OP, however I cannot be sure that the symptom happened at the same time.
FWIW, the folders with a greyed-out "Read only" indicator can be permanently
deleted but not moved to the recycle bin.

Andrew

Walter Clayton

2005-03-22 19:58:41 UTC

Post by Walter Clayton
What is displayed is an optional status change request for *files*
within the directory heirarchy.

So, what would cause that option to be enabled?

From what standpoint? Reflecting the current state of the RO attribute of
the target directory? If so, then MS would have to put the code back into
the GUI and doubt they will. RO on a directory is meaningless.

However, it works perfectly fine if you wish to change the RO attribute bits
for *files*.

Post by Andrew Morton
If the parent folder happens
to be subject to a reparse point, would that do it? If not, how do you find
what has enabled the status change request?

As you toggle the option it goes from indeterminate/do nothing to clear to
set. And to emphasis, this is action to apply against *files* withing the
directory heirarchy only. It will not touch any directory.

Post by Andrew Morton
For example, I used junction from www.sysinternals.com to redirect my
Desktop folder to a different partition and I am seeing the same symptom as
the OP, however I cannot be sure that the symptom happened at the same time.
FWIW, the folders with a greyed-out "Read only" indicator can be permanently
deleted but not moved to the recycle bin.
Andrew

Sure about that? I just deleted a directory into the recycle bin with RO
both set and not set. No fuss, no muss or bother. There is no such thing a
current 'grayed-out' state.

The RO indicator on the directory property sheet has absolutely *no* bearing
or relationship to the current state of *anything* on the machine. It is a
possible future state only, and only for *files*.

--
Walter Clayton
Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.
http://www.dts-l.org

Andrew Morton

2005-03-23 14:09:04 UTC

Post by Walter Clayton
What is displayed is an optional status change request for *files*
within the directory heirarchy.

So, what would cause that option to be enabled?

I thought you meant that the grey RO attribute on a folder indicated that
there was a status change request set.

<snip>

Post by Walter Clayton
Sure about that? I just deleted a directory into the recycle bin with
RO both set and not set. No fuss, no muss or bother. There is no such
thing a current 'grayed-out' state.

Oh yes there is! It looks like this:-
Loading Image...

I suppose the grey-out of the box makes it look like it is an inherited
property.

Also, when clearing it and clicking apply, a dialog comes up titled "Confirm
Attribute Changes" asking if I want to unset read-only for this folder only
or to this folder, subfolders and files.
Loading Image...

Allowing it to do the change makes no difference - the next time the
property sheet is displayed it has reverted to greyed-out.

Post by Walter Clayton
The RO indicator on the directory property sheet has absolutely *no*
bearing or relationship to the current state of *anything* on the
machine. It is a possible future state only, and only for *files*.

This is on NTFS on Windows Server 2003.
It has happened to every folder on every partition of every hard disk for
every user. They are basic, not dynamic, disks.
Chkdsk doesn't find any errors.
If I access the computer from another one (W2000) the read-only box is
clear.

Andrew

Walter Clayton

2005-03-24 02:49:49 UTC

Post by Walter Clayton
What is displayed is an optional status change request for *files*
within the directory heirarchy.

So, what would cause that option to be enabled?

I thought you meant that the grey RO attribute on a folder indicated that
there was a status change request set.

Nope. Means there is no intended *future* change. The inital state is "I
have no desire to make a change". As you toggle you are saying "I want to
clear the RO bit on *files* at some point in the future", then it switches
to "I want to set the RO bit on *files* at some point in the future" and
then back to "I have no desire to make a change".

It is a future state change and that is all it means. It is *totally*
divorced from current state.

Post by Andrew Morton
<snip>

Oh yes there is! It looks like this:-
http://www.in-press.co.uk/example/ROgrey.gif
I suppose the grey-out of the box makes it look like it is an inherited
property.

BINGO! The problem is it is *not* inherited. I has *nothing* do to with
current state. It is strictly and always future state change.

Post by Andrew Morton
Also, when clearing it and clicking apply, a dialog comes up titled "Confirm
Attribute Changes" asking if I want to unset read-only for this folder only
or to this folder, subfolders and files.
http://www.in-press.co.uk/example/confirm.gif
Allowing it to do the change makes no difference - the next time the
property sheet is displayed it has reverted to greyed-out.

Yep. It is *future* state. It *never* represents current sate.

Yep. That's beause in Win2K the GUI display the *current* state and did
allow the RO bit on a directory to be manipulated. And it would not matter
if the disks are dynamic or nor, FATxx or NTFS. On a directory the RO bit is
irrelevant.

Post by Andrew Morton
Andrew

Now for the fun. Copy the following into a bat file. Name it what you will,
run it and follow the instructions. During this test, pay careful attention
to the current state of the RO attribute bit vs. what is display in the
explorer GUI. You may modify the bat file as you see fit as long as the
overall intent is followed, which is to display current state information on
a directory and a file as the RO bit is *actually* changed.

------------------ start copy below this line------------------
c:
cd \
attrib -s -h boot.ini
md test
copy boot.ini c:\test
attrib +s +h boot.ini
cd test
md testnest
attrib -r testnest
@echo At this time use explorer to check the properties of c:\test\testnest.
@echo Be aware that the RO attribute of the directory testnest is *OFF* as
you can confirm by the following attrib output.
@echo While in explorer check the attributes of c:\test\boot.ini.
@echo At this time the RO attribute of c:\test\boot.ini is *OFF* as you can
confirm by the following attrib output.
@echo Hit any key to proceed to the next step
attrib testnest
attrib boot.ini
pause
attrib +r testnest
attrib +r boot.ini
@echo At this time use explorer to check the properties of c:\test\testnest
@echo Be aware that the RO attribute on c:\test\testnest is now *ON*
@echo While in explorer check the properteis of c:\test\boot.ini
@echo At this time the RO attribute of c:\test\boot.ini is *ON*
@echo Hit any key to delete the test directory and data.
attrib testnest
attrib boot.ini
pause
cd \
rmdir /s /q c:\test
@echo Test is now complete
pause
----------------stop copy above this line-------------------------

--
Walter Clayton
Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.

Andrew Morton

2005-03-24 10:16:37 UTC

OK, that's all clear. So, the box is /intended/ to be greyed out because the
future status of the entities is unknown? I don't have another WS2003 to
compare to.

However, this appears to be a red herring and unrelated to the OP.

I have now resolved my problem:-

The problem I had was that I had used a reparse point (junction?) to
redirect C:\Documents and Settings\Andrew\Desktop to D:\Desktop. Somehow
this prevented any subfolder from being sent to the Recycle Bin if it was
done via the desktop. Going to D:\Desktop through Windows Explorer does
allow the subfolders to be sent to the Recycle Bin.

So, instead I used the TweakUI PowerToy to change the location of the
Desktop folder to D:\Desktop and now I can delete folders from the desktop.

Is this a bug with reparse points?

Andrew

Walter Clayton

2005-03-24 16:50:15 UTC